Incorporating Cramond, Barnton, Cammo & Quality Street (West)

Minutes of Meeting held on Thurs 20th October 2022 at Cramond Kirk Hall

Participating: John Loudon (Chair), John Howison (Vice-chair), Gena Wylie (Treasurer), Peter Scott (Planning Lead), Bert Scott, Hamish Barrie, Percy Feketey, Sally Chalmers.

In attendance: Cllr Lang, Cllr Work and 11 Residents


Ian Williamson, Adam Cumming, Michael Ramsay and Michael Dick.

Introductory Remarks

John Loudon welcomed attendees and noted that this was the first ‘live’ Meeting for two years.

Approval of June 2022 Minutes and AGM

It was noted that Item 9 had been inserted twice.  The Minute was otherwise Approved following a Proposal by Gena Wylie.

Matters Arising

Peter Scott asked what was happening re the proposed 30mph Speed Limit on Queensferry Road and what was the western limit?  Cllr Lang said that design changes were in hand, but he thought progress would be made by the end of the year, he would check on the western limit.   

Afternote Cllr Lang has confirmed that Cramond Brig is the western limit.

CBCC Membership   

The Chair intimated that Jean Morley was retiring from the Committee and he wished to thank her for her hard work over many years. Fortunately, Dianne Stein who had taken a lot of interest in the Airport Action Group was willing to be co-opted and this was agreed. Kit Campbell who had done a very considerable amount of work re the Campus Site and other planning issues had resigned over a difference of opinion on how future relationships with AMA should be handled although it was still hoped that he would re-join.

Police Report   

Percy Feketey said that there was no Community Police Report available but a report to DMSA stated that there had been 2 residential and 1 business breaking in D’Mains in October plus reports of suspicious persons in the area. The Police recommended that empty premises should be made to look occupied with light-timers, cancelled milk, mail perhaps collected by neighbours and windows and doors closed and locked plus sheds and garages being made secure. The Police should be notified of suspicious individuals or vehicles in their street.

Afternote – NW Inspector Caroline Flynn sent apologies for non-attendance as Sgt Watt and PC McLeod were both on leave and she herself had been on a course.

The Cramond Inn

John Loudon summarised current position (no progress) but said that a Meeting had been arranged for 7.30 pm on 24 Oct in the Kirk Hall to discuss options such as ‘a Community Buyout’.

Hearing re TRO for Whitehouse Road Proposed Care Home  

John Howison reported that TROs were required for a ‘safe access’ but proposals were patently unsatisfactory, and the Reporter had to decide on the Evidence.

Jacob’s Traffic Study  

Info re Traffic Micro-analysis on operation of Barnton Junction still awaited. Bank Premises sold which could affect public access to the adjacent car park.

Airport Update  

See the report on our Facebook page or contact Ian Williamson by email.

Brighouse Mediation Update  

The Chair updated recent history following the appointment of the Mediator Keir Bloomer. Kit Campbell had done a lot of work on CC behalf and a Route Map had been prepared for a possible way-forward. At a Meeting the Mediator had asked if there was any Dissent from the Route Map Proposal and none was recorded. Views on the matter were diverse but there would be opportunities to review progress.

Cllr Lang said that he was happier now because (a) there were clear milestones (b) built-in consultation process and (c) now involved an Expert Sports Consultant.  His main concern was that any Appeal by AMA to the Scottish Govt would take matters out of Council control.

A discussion then followed, Hamish Barrie said that any involvement by Cricket Scotland would cost £250,000 which they did not have.

Peter Scott reminded all that Planning Permission had been granted and that AMA were now asking for a further 5-Year Extension. He suggested this should be restricted to 2 Years.  Kevin Lang agreed with this suggestion subject to a regular assessment of progress against the agreed milestones. 

The CBCC Submission was now prepared and required to be lodged for consideration by the CEC Planning Committee Meeting on 9th November 2022. The outcome and other matters are to be discussed at the Public Meeting at 7.30 pm on 28th November 2022 in the Millennium Hall.

Planning Update   

Peter Scott reported that the site for the Cammo Community Hub (which could include Meeting Rooms etc) had been sold to the ‘Flying Colours’ Nursery and the opportunity for the Hub had been lost.

Action- CC will write to CALA expressing disappointment as there had been previous discussions with CALA.

He also stated that a Street Traders’ Licence to trade adjacent to the Cammo Estate Car Park on Cammo Walk had been applied for, this was additional to the Application from the Leaf and Bean who now had a licence to trade by the Cammo Lodge. After discussion, CC agreed to recommend refusal as it could affect viability of Leaf and Bean plus create litter-problems. If CEC minded granting, there should be trading hours Conditions (9 am-5pm) and Licence should be on a temporary basis.

Secretary’s Update

See the update on our Facebook page or contact Ian Williamson by email.

Celebrate Cramond Event  

See the update on our Facebook page or contact Ian Williamson by email.

Cramond Collaborative Meeting of 9th Aug 2022   

See the update on our Facebook page or contact Ian Williamson by email.

Salvesen Steps and Dowies Mill   

See the update on our Facebook page or contact Ian Williamson by email.

Upgrading of Notice Boards   

The Chair reported that new locks had been fitted.  Following discussion, it was agreed that CBCC Minutes should be posted, also events notices from CEC, NW Edinburgh.

Autumn Newsletter   

The Chair suggested that Ideas should be submitted to Sally Chalmers.

Councillors’ Report

Kevin Lang reported on recent bus service changes. The 41 no longer used Queensferry Road which disadvantaged some people and there were complaints about the 43 service being unreliable with driver shortages being part of the problem.  Hamish Barrie commented that if the Fife Stagecoach Services stopped at Barnton Park (one extra stop added to a small number) it would be beneficial. He also felt that if there was integration of bus and rail tickets then Dalmeny Station could be better used by transferred bus passengers.


The placing of Memorial Benches was raised. The CEC Guidelines were that they should be available to sit-on however the bench on the Maybury Road was adorned with wreaths etc-  apparently this bench had been approved by the Roads Dept and the guidelines had not been followed.

The Chair stated that a ‘Joint Website’ for Cramond-based Associations had been suggested and a grant from the Airport had been applied for. Sally Chalmers felt it would be better and cheaper to have links from the Associations own websites to each other.   A new website would require constant updating and be costly.  Back links on websites tend to also improve the search engine ranking of website making them appear higher in google searches.  

Action- John Loudon to discuss further with Sally Chalmers.

Percy Feketey raised the matter of the recent surface dressing of Whitehouse Road and part of Gamekeepers Road. The day after the dressing had been laid there was heavy rainfall which lifted a lot of stone chippings leaving ‘bare streaks’ particularly down the centre of carriageways. There were also incomplete areas at crossings etc, and the white and yellow road markings had still not been replaced after several weeks, recreating the dangerous conditions prior to their imposition. Fortunately, most motorists realised the risks and the ‘double-parking’ etc problems had largely not re-incurred. Ian Williamson had been in touch with the consultant employed by the Roads Dept but had not received a reply.  Percy had previously expressed concern about the use of surface dressing on City Streets and these concerns have proved to be entirely relevant.

Gena Wylie as Treasurer voiced her concern over the Budget for CC activities, more funds were required as costs were on the up.   There was also concern that the formula which distributed grants to CCs was not sensitive to the fact that not all CCs had access to Council owned community facilities where low subsidised charges were available.  

Date of Next Meeting

Thursday 17 November 2022 at 7 PM at the Millennium Hall